With all the turmoil, unless Chuck takes a giant 1-10 dump, why would you fire him? He runs a clean program. Kids play hard and do well in school. I think he’s set here for a while.
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I generally agree with this idea - unless you’re sure that you have a home run hire who will win big immediately (essentially impossible with a MAC budget), there’s not much incentive to fire Martin. A new hire could tank the program, Martin’s floor is pretty clearly just being a middling ~5-7 MAC team.
I think the athletic department as a whole is ok with mediocre (barely missing out on bowl eligibility) to decent (winning the MAC in a weak year, beating a terrible P5 team in NW, winning a lower tier bowl game) being the range for the program if it means avoiding winless embarrassments of seasons.
Doesn’t mean as fans we need to be ok with it though. I’m rooting for Martin to figure things out and raise his current ceiling, but at some point I’d like to see things shaken up, rather than be stuck in this rut forever.
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I said DB’s. So you don’t think he wishes he had Rowan?
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So the bar is set at somewhere just below a mediocre MAC program, meaning a far less than mediocre G5 program? That’s certainly aspirational!
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CM is a solid coach that runs a very stable program. If it ain’t broke……
You’re not wrong. However, that’s where the program is for now.
So everybody’s OK with a contract extension for a 4-8 season in 2023 - with one MAC championship appearance and one title and one bowl win in 10 seasons. If so, the assumed quest for excellence by “graduating champions” rings pretty damned hollow.
I’m hoping for at least 8-4 this season. We should be favored in 8 games. I’m not OK with 5-7 or anything below that.
I’m wishfully rooting for an 11-2 and at least some votes for the Top 25. But if 4-8 is “where the program is right now” - at the end of 10 seasons - it’s time to at least try to rectify that.
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My response was more based on what I thought the Miami admin would do
But I probably wouldnt fire him unless it was hopeless
I think of Coach Martin tenure a lot like Charlie Coles without the charm
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Everyone keeps waiting for you to donate the giant check to help fix everything so I’m trying to be a realist!
Money and facilities don’t seem to be the problem with football. Several schools with similar budgets and worse facilities seem to be having better results.
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Money is a huge need. In football and across the board. Now, get that check book out or quit complaining because the sweepstakes van ain’t coming.
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Completely disagree on football compared to MAC and most G5 peers… Which MAC or other G5 teams have significantly more money to operate with, a better college environment and better football facilities than Miami? I’ll wait.
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Yeager is a dated stadium that is in no way up to par from an experience standpoint. NIL is non existent. Coaching salaries are on the low end. You know all this. As for other places running circles around us…give me Liberty. It’s not a good academic school and yet money has absolutely changed their trajectory. I’m sure there are more but I’m too tired to list. This is a silly conversation. Unless he finishes 1-10 he’s not going anywhere. Because…money.
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Colorado State comes to mind.
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There is nothing wrong with the Yager complex that a new press box and some VIP boxes wouldn’t correct. The setting is very nice, the indoor and football building are superb and the Cradle of Coaches Pavilion adds a very nice aesthetic touch.
Liberty? Nice! A religious school that uses a massive online college program to fund its football program in an effort to become the “Evangelical Protestant Notre Dame or BYU.”
I would argue JMU and Colorado State are ahead of us. SMU is ahead, too, and gunning for P5, which we aren’t. Tulane, under the past two ADs has progressed considerably from the days when they played in the Superdome.
The salaries in the MAC are mostly comparable to each other, with Toledo a bit ahead. The Glass Bowl and Infocision are probably the only stadium complexes in the MAC appreciably better than ours but the campus atmosphere is far worse on both the Toledo and Akron campuses. We should be in the top four in the MAC every year. Last season we finished 6th.
There are 64 teams in the Group of 5. Maybe a dozen or so have an appreciable advantage over Miami.
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The fans aren’t ok with it, attendance for games sucks. Sayler is content with the program flying under the radar. No NIL opportunities, not high profile, also no scandals. CM runs a tight ship and brought the program back, sort of. Miami football is boring. I was at several games last year and the stands are empty. I think the facilities are top notch. The students do not support football, again the games are boring. This is why I’m saying CM isn’t going anywhere. I think he’s doing exactly what Sayler wants. Just my opinion.
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Ballcoach1
Put that way, it sounds a lot like Miami has become an expensive Hamilton College Continentals football program without the emphasis on extreme high-end academics that sends former players off to med school, law school, MBA programs and on PhD tracks.
Hamilton consistently has a half empty Steuben Field, student and alumni apathy and a fairly constant string of 3-5, 4-4 and occasional 5-3 records - always off the radar in the predictions for a NESCAC championship. But nobody gets in trouble. But hey! It’s D3 Little Ivy football, not the FBS Group of 5.
If I remember correctly guys like Ara, Bo, Bill, Terry, and Randy ran tight ships, too. It just seems they mixed in a bit more winning and the winning is what breeds the excitement.
At this stage my personal football jury hasn’t finalized a verdict on CM. He still has this season to prove himself capable of something exceptional - a fun, consistently good, near double digit winning season that might spark alumni, student and fan interest again. I am in his corner full-stop this season and wishing him the best. I’m even planning on attending at least three road games as well as the MAC Championship and a bowl game if we get to them - and all at age 74 and from distant Coastal NC.
My brother, Miami ‘73, is a personal friend of Tulane AD Troy Dannen, from the day when Troy was AD at UNI. My brother lives near the UNI campus. Troy has done wonderful things at both schools, not just the wealthy private one in the Garden District. He was one of three ADs who were finalists for AD of the year in last season’s awards. Producing positive results on the field, court and ice would greatly benefit DS’s stature as an AD. I hope he still cares about that professionally. Producing clean mediocrity leaves you - as you said - off the radar.
That practice also costs the university long term. We’ve got way too much money invested in this program to let it wallow much longer in the doldrums of mediocrity.
Within a few years or so, voices like mine will fall silent. Will others be there to revive the quest? I certainly hope so, but after 20 years of mostly mediocre performance that created thousands of emotionally detached, apathetic new alumni, I am doubtful.
Love & Honor anyway!
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I actually had not thought of most of those points. However, as usual, you brought up several points that are correct. I like CM, most of the time. I do think he is very old school and does not relate well to most of the players. I’m older than CM and stopped coaching several years ago. I noticed years ago kids had changed. The college coaches I am in contact with now have told me it gets worse every year. NIL and portal have made it worse. The high school and college kids today are not motivated by the threats, screaming, almost maniacal behavior. Therefore, Chuck will struggle more each year connecting and getting the most out of his players. Sayler seems good with this. I would love to see a new young coach take over the HC role and build some excitement. Explosive offense will get the fans back fast. Contending for MAC championships annually will get the fans and students back. The change can still happen. However with Chuck at the helm, the next few years will be the same as the last few. 5-7 wins and a meaningless bowl game with no fan support and even less student body support.
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My hope is that the 2023 team absolutely kills it, ends up something like 12-2, is nationally ranked and accordingly, Chuck finally gets that big money offer, perhaps from the Northwestern Wildcats in his old stomping grounds.
The portal, relaxed transfer rules and NIL have made most student athletes free agents these days. They will leave if not appreciated.
I’m not a Miami football insider but I don’t hear any stories about any player abuse from CM. I assume his old school nature merely has him barking a lot. Whatever he’s doing needs to turn into more wins this season or we can make the assumption it doesn’t work well.
Well I managed to get my ticket for the UMass game right when single-game tickets went on sale at 10 this morning. Fortunately I managed to beat the tens of thousands who I’m sure were about to crash the website as they all tried to reserve their seats.
Yeah at 10:04, I had middle of the 4th row on the 50-yard line on the Miami sideline. And the only reason I had to “settle” for row D was because the first three rows were blocked off (I’m guessing those are for family members of Miami players.)
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