But again, why?
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I think a conference needs a minimum of 6 teams to qualify for an NCAA tournament automatic bid.
I donāt know why leaving to a worse conference makes the team better. It is a lot easier to convince a recruit to play against UND, DU, etc., than it is to convince them to sit on a bus to play Lake St. or Michigan Tech. For example, Vanderbilt has a better football team than Miami, better recruiting classes, and a hell of a lot more revenue from the conference. If we canāt recruit now, how are we going to recruit from a worse league?
Itās easier to get an at-large bid from a bigger conference. The WCHA had 0 in 2016, 0 in 2017, 1 in 2018 (Minn St lost the tourney), and 1 in 2019 (BG). Itās not even like there are bowl games in hockey where it is good to be 6-6.
We are not going to magically get better by going to a worse conference. The same problems ā whatever they are ā will still be there. Itās fine yāall donāt like a losing record. I donāt either. But changing conferences is not the solution.
The notion that the NCHC is going to fold is just specious. We are either leaving and paying the exit fee or staying. Any cost savings would have to be greater than the exit fee and Iām not convinced that is true.
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Also, you are speaking of leverage from the Summit League like it is mandatory for these schools to join once the summit league sponsors hockey. I donāt think thatās the case. The ACC couldnāt make Notre Dame join. It isnāt leverage for the mere existence of the Summit League for hockey, there has to be an actual reason why DU, UND, UMD, etc. want to switch.
The answer to that question is that winning breeds more winning and losing breeds more losing. No one wants to go to a noncompetitive program, which is what we have become. People want to go to a winning program. In the CCHA we would have the best facilities and the best tradition and should be able to start winning again. That would bring back fans that have given up ( and there are lots of them). To some fans it is important to play against the best, but most of our fans do not think of these NCHC teams as the best. Playing name schools would be more valueable to most fans. People used to get more excited beating Michigan, Michigan State, Notre Dame or Ohio State than anybody else. Beating Minnesota Duluth or Denver simply does not mean as much. I know and understand the difference, but even I would much rather play the Big Ten or MAC schools than North Dakota or UNO. I would much rather win vs lesser teams than be noncompetitive vs the distant hockey school we have nothing in common with.
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Unfortunately for us the chance to beat Michigan, Ohio State or Notre Dame doesnt exist in any of our options except for non conference. I dont think we have much luck scheduling those teams non conference either (we did get MSU)
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We canāt go back to the old
Ccha. Iām not sure that the current group
Is any more attractive. At least for
People who know hockey realize they are good teams in the nchc. So it comes down to an expectation that we will
Dominate in the new ccha.
On this one, I tend to share Dickās sentimentsā¦no one wants to come out to see a perennial loserā¦it just isnāt any fun! Unless dramatic improvement is imminent,I think we should explore going to the new CCHA as a viable option to get our fans back into the program.
But the reality is that student-athletes do want to go to bigger programs even if they lose. Again, there is a reason we get stomped by bottom feeders of bigger conferences in other sports.
It isnāt just the athletes. These bottom feeders in other sports have better attendance than us too. Playing Ferris State and Lake State does not manage to excite fans and put butts in the seat. People havenāt even heard of those schools, nevermind whether they know about their hockey programs. People do understand rankings. When people see #5 DU (sorry, iām not looking at actual current rankings), they know itās a big game. We donāt secure a home-and-home with OSU by joining the CCHA.
We are not winning against lesser teams now. That doesnāt change because we are in a conference with them. It is not like we are cruising in non-conference play and then getting wrecked in conference play. We are getting wrecked in both. Look at our recent record against BG, Ferris, or whoever else.
We either build a good program again or we donāt. It feels like the āgo back to the CCHA!ā is coming from a sense of nostalgia for one the program was once in the conference it used to be in. It is telling that the sense of nostalgia is for the Big Ten schools are no longer even in the conference. The old CCHA is not coming back.
Like, if it is just as simple as moving to a lesser conference, do you think we should drop the basketball team to the Ohio Valley Conference until we are a good program again? That would rightfully be laughed off the board. It goes the other way too ā Iām pretty sure some of you would commit war crimes to join C-USA tomorrow.
Quite frankly, I do not think we are making any progress at all in rebuilding in this conference. In order to compete in this league, you have to basically be a top ten program. Every year we get furthur and furthur away from that.
Yes, I think in the new CCHA we would have the best facility, the best school, the best tradition. I think we could rebuild quickly there and start experiencing success again, which would bring back interest and fans. Every year we are losing more and more season ticket holders and the crowds become smaller and smaller. Last Saturday, playing the #5 team in the nation, it was about 60% full. That is with all the students on campus. What happens for home games over the next 6 weeks? Also, compared to what we used to see, no one was having much fun at the game.
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This thread hurts my brain.
- Why on Gods green earth would Summit want to sponsor menās ice hockey? UND is never going to let their baby go away. Never.
- Before Blasi left in disgrace I posted a thesis on where I felt we stood in the college hockey pecking order. tl;dr version is weāre a mid-major player acting like a blue blood. We need to embrace who/where we are.
- Folks, the nCCHA is a very good, 2-bid league. These guys are not the WCHA train wreck weāve poked fun of in the past.
- BFD if the NCHC is a 4-bid league. As the world stands right now, weāre never going to get one of those spots.
- With that said, Iām in the stay in the NCHC camp. That doesnāt mean we donāt make changes. But Iām also ok if we move to the nCCHA with the current coaching staff. Everyone knows where I stand with these guys so I wonāt go into that again.
- Bottom line is I want to win. Losing sucks. Losing begets more losing. We are the college hockey punchline. Either give me a staff that can win in the SEC of college hockey or move us to a league where Berge can dominate.
Back to lurking.
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It seems like the NCHC is a much better place to be than the CCHA if youāre good. Itās probably easier to become good in the CCHA, but I donāt think weāre necessarily doomed in the NCHC. Hockey takes a longer time to rebuild than other sports and Covid threw a major wrench in things. Weāve regressed a little this season, but rebuilding a program isnāt a linear process. Buffalo went 2-10 in Lance Leipoldās second season after going 5-7 in his first season.
Iāll defer to the people who understand college hockey better than me to know when the time will come to put up or shut up, but weāre not there yet. If we continue to be terrible for a couple more seasons with no signs of progress, it may be time to look for an exit strategy, but I donāt think a move makes sense right now.
College hockey has the worst postseason in college sports. Single elimination in hockey doesnāt give you the true best champion very often. We need to find a way to get back into the tournament and then hope for the best in the tournament.
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We are not making progress in rebuilding the basketball team in the MAC. We finished last in the east like 4 out of the 5 last years and won like one MAC tournament game in the same timespan. Millet is usually about 10% full for conference games. That is with all students on campus. Why donāt we move to the OVC? We would have the best facility, the best school, the best tradition, which would bring back interest and fans. (I canāt copy the part about basketball crowds getting smaller and smaller because, well, that ship sailed 15 years ago.) Plus, the OVC has an opening - we can replace Belmont and hopefully start making the NCAA tournament every year like Belmont has.
Iām sure you get my point. Iām not trying to start an old basketball v hockey fight, but dropping conferences has the exact same downsides in hockey as it does in basketball.
And again, Iām not hearing why we magically start winning in the CCHA. We are already losing to CCHA teams right now.
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College hockey is a niche sport. I donāt think comparisons or analogies to full revenue sports like football and menās basketball are 1-for-1.
Back to lurking.
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The MAC to OVC example youāre using doesnāt really make sense. The MAC is the home for all Miami sports, save for one prominent program.
Count me with others that fail to see the financial, competitive and rivalry benefits of the NCHC.
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Well, we can move all sports then! Weād dominate FCS. I have been told that winning begets winning, so letās go for the most winning that we can, right? And imagine the money weād save by dropping to FCS! It is a lot more than weād save from switching hockey conferences.
It is telling that you are responding by fighting the hypothetical and satirical point, rather than the underlying points Iāve spelled out. Plus, youāre not even addressing the crux of it. I will try it differently: would you rather be us or Belmont in MBB? I suspect most of you donāt want to be Belmont even though they have consistent winning seasons and NCAA tourney appearances.
No, mainly I donāt know what point youāre trying to make except NCHC = good. Which is fine, thatās your opinion, I simply disagree.
My earlier posts are pretty clear.
(sorry, I posted this twice)
I would absolutely rather be Belmont than us in MBB.
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