Albies broke his wrist and is out for 8 weeks. Could be a landing spot for India.
Montas and Martinez would be prime trade candidates.
Sims and Farmer are both free agents next year, they should be on the trade block.
Cruz has had struggles this year, not sure if there would be much return on him but probably right that he has peaked.
Moll still has three years of control left and is pitching well. He could command a decent return but the Reds should still be in the mindset of reaching the playoffs next season so not a lock that heās on the block.
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Nothing to be surprised about. Team is not good and has been bad pretty much all year.
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Team stinks
Braves called up their top infielder Nacho Alvarez Jr for his debut against the reds, I donāt think India will be going to the 404
Would be nice if Candelario would get hot againā¦even if that only helps his trade value. Martinez should have some value, not sure about Montas.
I think the Reds overused Fernando Cruz this season, and that is why heās faltered this past month. Definitely keep Moll. Farmer and Sims wonāt bring much in return. They do have good bullpen depth, so trading pen arms wonāt hurt. Would like another look at Zulueta and a first look at Maxwell.
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Iād love it if my Padres could get Martinez back, but his contract is kinda rough and the Reds would probably have to eat some of it
Rumors are that the Orioles are interested in Montas and Martinez if they canāt make a splashier deal. Thatās probably about where they are in value, someoneās backup plan. Baltimore has a few OF on their top 30.
Chris Solomon, from No Laying Up, is a huge Reds fan (and a Miami grad, I think). He lays out the current status of the Reds and what they need to do for 2025 and ā26. He outlines it the best Iāve seen (the thread is fairly long):
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Charlie Brown and the football for us fans. I read his review and no disrespect to him but itās been 35 years since 1990. The org needs an overhaul. Look at the Brewers. They have been consistently good for a while now. They are not a bigger market than the Reds (keep me honest here) but they have a solid plan and I think I could even tell you their style of play. We donāt really have that identity. At least to me we donāt. But we used to. And we could again.
I think the last thing the Reds need is an overhaul. While the current ownership leaves a lot to be desired the front office has assembled one heck of a talent pool through drafting, international signing and trades. No need to bring in Walt Jocketty 2.0 to dismantle what they have assembled.
It seems to me like we have an identity. We are athletic, aggressive and fun with strong middle in the field but careless and mistake prone. Credit and criticism for that are on Bell. Heās got to find a way to keep the former and get rid of the latter or he needs to go because good clubs donāt make the kind of mistakes we do.
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The identity you suggested we have is like me making a sports car and pitching it as āfast, muscular and dangerousā. No good.
We stink.
I disagree about there being no need for an overhaul. I think the team is out of it for this year, unfortunately, and should trade off all pieces that are likely to leave in the offseason. The potential trade of Candy and India is because the team still has a glut of infielders when next year rolls around, and it would be wise to get something for one of them.
The rotation is not looking to be a problem in the future. There are lots of good bullpen pieces (at least the potential is there, always a crapshoot) and itās always good to flip bullpen when they have value since it is the most inconsistent group. The team will return players next year, but I still think they should do everything they can to get a middle of the order thumper. Return Friedl and Mclain, get one all star worthy bat, and the team will be dangerous. None of the moves that Iāve seen suggested would change that, but they would add some depth to the organization.
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I wouldnāt call trading off pieces that are not part of the long term future when you are not likely to contend an overhaul. An overhaul is starting over, they donāt need to start over. They need to keep tweaking the roster to shore up weaknesses with long term goals in mind.
I doubt Candelario has much of a trade market right now. I hope he doesnāt end up like the Moustakas signing but they are probably stuck with him for better or worse.
Unless they get a major league ready OF in return, they should hold onto India. Heās got a friendly contract for 2025 and two more seasons of control and they can always go back to the plan of moving him to the OF when the injured list clears up.
For 2025 an OF that might be a good fit on the free agent market is a familiar face in Jessie Winker. Heās having a bounce back season and could possibly be signed on a 2-3 year deal that doesnāt break the bank.
But itās an identity. Add some seatbelts and airbags in the form of cleaning up mistakes and we no longer stink, no? Unless youāre really advocating for blowing the whole thing up and starting another rebuild.
Youāre basically describing the Edsel.
We might have an identity (I disagree with your take as I donāt think we really do) but for discussion, is it a good one? No. We lose to terrible teams routinely. Like last night. Hereās a wild thought:
-a stinky team like the Reds can win 70 games this year. A lot of terrible teams win 70 every year.
-how many more could we win with better play (and I donāt mean all star play, I mean no errors sort of play. Iāll say at least 5 by EOY (bumping us from 70 to 75 wins.)
- you can be in the wild card or sometimes division hunt with 90 wins. this means even a shitty team like the reds will have only been 15 wins from being right there.
-this last point is what paralyses most franchises. āWe were so closeā¦keep what we had and add a pick up or two and weāre there!ā Reds have been in this special place of Franchise Purgatory forever.
Thing is, with better management and vision we could blow this thing up, rebuild and be closer to winning in 2 years than we are today.
To me, perhaps the greatest risk in life is not taking risks. My friend is an Eagles fan and when they fired Reid a number of years ago, I was stunned. He said āNah. Ownership isnāt happy with being āright thereā. They want it all.ā Now granted, Reid has done incredible in KC and this is about baseball not football, but I think the parallel to the Reds is important. Why are we afraid to blow it up for a chance at something better? Itās not like weāve sniffed the World Series in 35 years. What is the risk?
First off, I completely agree this team makes too many physical and mental errors right now. I think thatās a big reason for their poor 1-run record. Maybe a managerial change is in order.
Look at recent results of blowing it all upā¦
The Reds blew it up in 2015 when they had a starting rotation that were all getting expensive at the same time. 2016-2019 were putrid.
They raised their payroll to the highest ever via trades and free agents prior to 2020 and then lost a boatload of money in 2020, and had a decent 2021 before again blowing it all up. 2022 was brutal, and 2023 was supposed to be bad as well but so many of the young guys outperformed expectations and they were in a playoff spot until pitching injuries gutted the rotation.
This year the pitching has been good, they are building depth in the minors, Greene and Lodolo look like top of rotation guys, and Elly is becoming a superstar. Oh, and their best players are all under control for the next 2-5 years.
They need to spend more money. They need to trade for a big bat in the OF and sign another. Iām fine if they trade India, but not for some teamās 20th-ranked prospect. Iām fine if they trade relievers, even Diaz, if it brings a good hitting OF in return.
But blow it up again (3rd time in 10 years with only 3 barely above .500 seasons to show for the last 2 tear downs), when youāve already got a talented, young and inexpensive pitching staff, a crop of good prospects going thru growing pains, a bunch of injuries to key position players, and youāre wanting to repeat 2016-2019 where you have only Elly (instead of only Joey)? By the time theyāre ready to compete again, 2-4 years from now, Elly will have 1 foot out the door. Donāt waste his next few years.
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Just because itās an identity that you do not care for does not make it no longer an identity.
Without the mistakes the team on the field this year is more like an 85 win team based on runs scored and runs allowed and itās incomplete.
How many game could they win with a full season of Marte, Friedl, McLain and eliminating the bad baserunning and fielding mistakes? Thatās potentially a 92 win team before potential pitching improvements.
The Krall lead Reds are not even in the position youāve described, they are in year three of the 2022 reset. In the 2022 reset they saw what they had on the field in 2021 wasnāt working, they got fād financially by Covid and they blew it up. This doesnāt seem like the purgatory franchise you describe. In the Jocketty era, yeah they were that franchise.
This club hasnāt even hit whatever their peak might be. They have a collection of some of the most exciting young talent they have had in decades and instead of giving them a chance to come back from an injury decimating setback youād rather blow it up with another 2-3 year rebuild and roll the dice on other prospects? If it takes replacing Bell to clean up the mistakes sure do it.
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There is a lot of truth in what everyone is saying. A couple of days ago l was looking at run differential stats and the Reds were 5th in the league, 40 runs to the good. So why are we below .500? That speaks to the frustration that Yellow is expressing. Do we lead the majors in outs made while running the bases?
I do think the run differential supports the idea that we have enough talent to be a much better team but maybe we just donāt play smart, fundamental baseball. Pete Rose was super aggressive but almost never got thrown out. I watch the Guardians all the time and they are winning with less talent. Jose Ramirez and Andres Giminez make spectacular base running plays but almost always are safe. The Guardians steal a lot, not as often as the Reds, but with a much higher percentage of success. They always sprint to first base and often think double from the first step out of the box and are ready for a bad hop or a bobble. And they seldom get thrown out. They work on this stuff in Spring training and throughout their system every day. I think there are good reasons why they win pretty consistently year after year and the Reds donāt.
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Dick, take a look at official base running team statistics:
Both Cincy and Cleveland have been thrown out stealing 31 times. Reds have 147 steals and Guards only 87. Reds way more successful.
Now Reds are tied for worst at getting thrown out on the bases (39 times), but Guards are not much better at 4th-worst (36).
Also, extra bases taken percentage, Reds are 2nd at 50% while Guards are at 44%. So again Reds are better there.
With almost 30 seasons of futility since the Reds last advanced in the playoffs, I get it. EVERY Reds mistake on the bases or in the field, every strikeout with runners in scoring position, every blown saveā¦ all hurt more because of death by a million pin pricks true Reds fans have endured over the past 3 decades. Weāre all frustrated and tired of the losing.
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Hunter Greene in July (not including the All Star game haha):
27.0 IP, 1 R, 9 H, 29 K, 6 BB, 0.33 ERA
Edit: Reds went 2-2 in those 4 games. 